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Alive, Ash, and Bad: Name the proper method of murdering children, according to the bible. FAMILY STONE THEM TO DEATH Deuteronomy 21:21 DROWN THEM Matthew 18:6 21 | FATHERS SHOULD EAT SONS 8 Ezekiel 5:10 POISON THEM Deuteronomy 32:24 DASH THEM AGAINST STONES KILL THEM WITH DEATH Revelations 2:23 11 Psalms 137:9 SET FIRE TO THEM 10 STARVE THEM TO DEATH Lev 10:3 Lamentations 4:4 <p><a href="http://marumina.tumblr.com/post/101601096550/this-is-intended-to-be-a-sort-of-gotcha-but" class="tumblr_blog">marumina</a>:</p> <blockquote><p>This is intended to be a sort of “gotcha,” but what this really is is gross misinterpretation.</p> <p>Let’s take what each of these verses actually say, shall we?  Then we will look at what they actually mean.</p> <p>Deuteronomy 21:21 as a verse itself can only be understood in the context of the other verses in the passage, so I will provide them here.</p> <p>Deuteronomy 21:18 - If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him,</p> <p>21:19 - his father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town.</p> <p>21:20 - They shall say to the elders, “This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a glutton and a drunkard.”</p> <p>21:21 - Then all the men of his town are to stone him to death. You must purge the evil from among you. All Israel will hear of it and be afraid.</p> <p>A drunkard?  Now how many little kids do you know are guzzling alcohol?  Certainly not in that culture and time, at least.  So already we can get the sense that they’re most likely referring to adult children.  When we think of children in Western culture, we always assume young children, but technically, even if you’re 30 years old, you’re still your mother and father’s child, even though you are not <em>a</em> child in the eyes of the society in which you were raised.  But family ties were extremely significant to the Jewish people in the era of the Old Testament, specifically ties between parents and their progeny.</p> <p>It’s also important to note that the punishments for sin in the Old Testament were exclusive to the Jews in that time period.  It was a temporary theocracy system, and later, in the Book of Hebrews, Jesus tells His Jewish followers that they cannot follow Him and also make sacrifices and judgments according to Moses’ Law.  Jesus fulfilled the Law when He died on the cross.  That’s not to say that now we cannot send people to jail for murdering someone - simply that we are not bound by Moses’ Law.  The moral laws, such as loving your neighbor, not stealing, not lying, not being jealous of others, are timeless, but the actual legal/justice system in Moses’ Law was temporary.</p> <p>Matthew 18:6 - “If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.”</p> <p>Children in this case are referred to as Jesus’ followers in the context of this passage.  Jesus is using the example of children as a metaphor.  But even so, it doesn’t say that the <em>children</em> are the ones to get drowned - it’s those who influence them to do bad things.  And notice how he doesn’t say “you must drown them,” - he is saying that it would be <em>better</em> for them to drown than to cause one of God’s children to do bad things, like hatred against your fellow man, etc. etc.  Which implies that the spiritual consequences will be grave, since there are no earthly consequences for influencing a Christian to do bad.  So this passage doesn’t even <em>imply</em> punishing children at all, unless you’re going to do some huge nonsense mental acrobatics.</p> <p>Revelations 2:23 - I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds.</p> <p>This is Jesus speaking exclusively about Jezebel’s children, if you read the previous verses.  Jezebel’s children were already adults before Jesus made this statement, in fact two of her sons had succeeded their father’s throne (one after the other, since the first son died), so they are completely responsible for their own deeds, good or bad.  Jezebel was a queen of Israel who called herself a prophet, but she did many evil, selfish things, trying to justify herself by saying she was doing right by God.  She believed a king had absolute power and could do whatever he wished because his word was law, even if he did bad.  She murdered several prophets (1 Kings 18:4) in an attempt to convert the Israelites to polytheism.  She also had a man stoned to death because he refused to sell his vineyard to her husband, the king (1 Kings 21:1-14).  So she wasn’t exactly the best person.</p> <p>Leviticus 10:3 - Moses then said to Aaron, “This is what the L<span class="yhwh">ORD</span> spoke of when he said: “ ‘Among those who approach me I will be proved holy; in the sight of all the people I will be honored.’ ” Aaron remained silent.</p> <p>I assume there was a mistake here, because this verse doesn’t refer to burning children whatsoever!  But if you read the previous verses, you find that who actually died were two of the sons of Aaron, the head priest.  They themselves were priests, and to be a priest at that time, you had to be around 30 years old.  So, again, old enough to be made accountable for your actions.</p> <p>Ezekiel 5:10 - Therefore in your midst parents will eat their children, and children will eat their parents. I will inflict punishment on you and will scatter all your survivors to the winds.</p> <p>This is specifically a prophesy given the context of the passage, not a moral command.</p> <p>Ezekiel 5:5-10 - “This is what the Sovereign L<span class="yhwh">ORD</span> says: This is Jerusalem, which I have set in the center of the nations, with countries all around her.</p> <p>&ldquo;Yet in her wickedness she has rebelled against my laws and decrees more than the nations and countries around her. She has rejected my laws and has not followed my decrees.</p> <p>“Therefore this is what the Sovereign L<span class="yhwh" id="yui-gen111">ORD</span> says: You have been more unruly than the nations around you and have not followed my decrees or kept my laws. You have not even conformed to the standards of the nations around you.</p> <p>&quot;Because of all your detestable idols, I will do to you what I have never done before and will never do again.</p> <p>Therefore in your midst parents will eat their children, and children will eat their parents. I will inflict punishment on you and will scatter all your survivors to the winds.”</p> <p>It is clearly a prophesy of what the people of Israel would do when they turned their backs against God, which eventually happened in 2 Kings.  It is not a condoning of cannibalism, because the Bible repeatedly declares murder as an atrocious sin.<span>  Right after the declaration of prophesy, God states that Israel would be punished for doing such things.<br/></span></p> <p><span>Deuteronomy 32:24 - “</span>I will send wasting famine against them, consuming pestilence and deadly plague; I will send against them the fangs of wild beasts, the venom of vipers that glide in the dust.”</p> <p>This entire chapter (Deuteronomy 32) is dedicated to what would happen to Israel if they started doing evil things and turning their backs on God.  “Sons and daughters” tie in with the idea that when you are a follower of God, you are God’s son or daughter.  Just like when you’re 40, and your parents are still alive, you’re still their son or daughter.</p> <p>Psalms 137:9</p> <p>&quot;Happy is the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.&rdquo;</p> <p>Hmm!  Now this seems more direct, right?  Except it’s not.  This is from a short chapter of Psalms, so I’ll provide the other verses.</p> <p>Psalms 137:1-9</p> <p>&ldquo;By the rivers of Babylon we sat and wept when we remembered Zion.</p> <p>There on the poplars we hung our harps,</p> <p>for there our captors asked us for songs, our tormentors demanded songs of joy; they said, “Sing us one of the songs of Zion!”</p> <p>How can we sing the songs of the L<span class="yhwh">ORD</span> while in a foreign land?</p> <p>If I forget you, Jerusalem, may my right hand forget its skill.</p> <p>May my tongue cling to the roof of my mouth if I do not remember you, if I do not consider Jerusalem my highest joy.</p> <p>Remember, L<span class="yhwh" id="yui-gen62">ORD</span>, what the Edomites did on the day Jerusalem fell. “Tear it down,” they cried, “tear it down to its foundations!”</p> <p>Daughter Babylon, doomed to destruction, happy is the one who repays you according to what you have done to us.</p> <p>Happy is the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.”</p> <p>Since the writer of this Psalm (and the Psalms in general) is widely agreed to have been King David, taken into context with the entire chapter, Psalms 137:9 seems to be one part of David’s lamenting of his loss of Jerusalem.  It’s important to note that the Bible is not entirely made up of moral doctrines - it also tells a story, and gets into the hearts and minds of many different people.</p> <p>Anyone reading line 9, after having read the previous lines and indeed, most of the Psalms, would see that this line is just a ruler regretting the loss of his kingdom.</p> <p>Lamentations 4:4 - Because of thirst the infant’s tongue sticks to the roof of its mouth; the children beg for bread, but no one gives it to them.</p> <p>Now, if you read the rest of the chapter, you will see that this too is a lamentation (hence the title, haha!).  This is not a moral command - this is an account of how the people of Israel are slacking in following up on God’s moral commands, and because of that, they are causing children to starve.  Read the first five verses together now:</p> <p>Lamentations 4:1-5</p> <p>&quot;How the gold has lost its luster, the fine gold become dull! The sacred gems are scattered at every street corner.</p> <p>&quot;How the precious children of Zion [Israel, essentially], once worth their weight in gold, are now considered as pots of clay, the work of a potter’s hands!</p> <p>&quot;Even jackals offer their breasts to nurse their young, but my people have become heartless like ostriches in the desert.</p> <p>&quot;Because of thirst the infant’s tongue sticks to the roof of its mouth; the children beg for bread, but no one gives it to them.</p> <p>&quot;Those who once ate delicacies are destitute in the streets. Those brought up in royal purple now lie on ash heaps.&rdquo;</p> <p>That line there - “but my people have become heartless like ostriches in the desert.”  It is because of Israel’s degradation and refusal to consistently follow the moral commands given to them by God, that eventually, this situation came about.  The reason children are being starved is because the Israelites are not feeding them - they’re slacking off, basically.  This line, too, is not a moral command, then - it is the author recording the suffering of Israel because they stopped following their moral code, given to them by God.</p> <p>Now overall, what do all my explanations show you?  It shows you that some people will do anything to claim my faith is evil, even going so far as to completely ignore context - the very basics of literary hermeneutics - and instead cherry-pick verses that at first glance seem problematic, but deeper reading proves quite the opposite.</p></blockquote>

marumina: This is intended to be a sort of “gotcha,” but what this really is is gross misinterpretation. Let’s take what each of these vers...