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Celtic, Driving, and Heaven: Adrian Bott @Cavalorn Follow l did some research into 'the veil between the worlds' a while back. Not a single example of a pre-Victorian use 5:53 AM -30 Oct 2017 53 Retweets 115 Likes O@ ⑤ 垂線) Iweet your reply Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 12h Replying to @Cavalorn The concept of 'thin places' (where the 'veil between worlds' is thin) was even worse - deemed 'ancient Celtic', actually invented in 1938. 2 26 51 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h Obviously if 'the veil between worlds' is a Victorian invention then the belief that Samhain is when 'the veil is thinnest' is equally bogus 1 8 21 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h Currently trying to track down the earliest reference to Samhain being the time when the veil grows thin'. Suspect it will be in 1970s. 10 2 28 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h The fact that we unwittingly view ancient seasonal celebrations through a lens of 19th century Spiritualist Christianity is a big deal to me 1 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h Marking Samhain as 'the time when the veil grows thin' isn't perpetuating Old Ways, it's misrepresenting them 1 6 25 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h So far as I can tell, 'the veil' as a theological concept began as 'the veil between Earth and Heaven' & was co-opted into Spiritualism.. 4 6 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h in which context it served an almost theatric role as the barrier between the desired-for ectoplasmic manifestations & the attendees 4 13 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h Point I'm driving at is that this belief that mortal & spirit worlds were divided by a 'veil' is COMPLETELY ABSENT from such lore as we have 1 7 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 10h The insistence that the earthly & mortal is in one place & the spiritual & eternal is in another is being IMPOSED on the old traditions Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h Nowadays we don't think of spirits' or Gods' realms as physical places, but as planes'. But back then, the Gods lived on Mount Olympus. 1 3 15 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h Heaven was believed to be as physical as Earth. Hell could be reached through openings in rocks. The whole cosmology was different. 4 18 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h Human experience of the world was such that the place where the Gods lived was imagined to be a place like this, only not near here. 3 3 9 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h Of course, now that the Earth is mapped, we needed to imagine otherworlds as 'higher planes'. It was the only place for the unknown to be. 3 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h The idea of superimposition, borrowed from photography, was a convenient analogy for how people thought the spirit world interacted w/ ours. 4 17 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h The less magical the world was believed to be, the more it became necessary to posit a division between us and the realms of wonder. 2 9 21 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h Hence the Spiritualist concept of the Veil, born of parlour room seances & now retrospectively cast as a key element of Samhain. 10 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 3h But here's the thing. The Sidhe, the 'people of the mounds', were believed to live in the mounds. The tumuli. A *physical* reality. 2 4 16 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 2h There was no pious division of things into the mundane & the spiritual; the idea of the mundane hadn't been invented yet. 1 5 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 2h Mundanity is a product of modernity, and the Spirit Realm behind its sodding Veil was only imagined as a necessary contrast (& salve) to it. 8 23 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 2h In summary, Samhain is not a time when the Veil grows thin, because there never was a Veil in the old tales, and magic was *everywhere*. 4 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 2h This isn't meant as snark or cynicism. People learn this stuff and pass it on in good faith. Just please interrogate what you inherit, ok'? 2 3 19 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 1h It's not necessary to buy into the whole 19thC metaphysical hooha of a Veil in order to appreciate the tales of, say, fairie folk riding. 2 8 Adrian Bott @Cavalorn 1h And there's certainly no suggestion that the trolls who descend from their fastnesses on that night do so because the pesky Veil is thin. 2 7 <p><a href="https://caledoniaseries.tumblr.com/post/166973938572/unauthorized-magic-this-thread-is-so-good" class="tumblr_blog">caledoniaseries</a>:</p> <blockquote> <p><a href="http://unauthorized-magic.tumblr.com/post/166963134224/this-thread-is-so-good" class="tumblr_blog">unauthorized-magic</a>:</p> <blockquote><p>This thread is so good. </p></blockquote> <p>THIS. ^^ </p> <p>As a folklorist, this kind of thing bothers the hell out of me. <i>So much </i>of what people think of as <i>ancient</i> is Victorian era or newer. Or just wildly inaccurate, really.</p> </blockquote>

caledoniaseries: unauthorized-magic: This thread is so good.  THIS. ^^  As a folklorist, this kind of thing bothers the hell out of me. So ...